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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2012 11:34:56 GMT -6
Rays Send: Hunter Pence $24M 2012+* Andrew Bailey $6.80M 2012* Cubs Send: Grady Sizemore $17M 2013* Seth Smith $5M 2014* A-RAM's RFA Adam JONES RFA Pat Neshek $1.5M 2013* Prospect Marc Kraus Reid Brignac *Rookie contract* $1.75 Prospect Phillippe Aumont I accept!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2012 11:40:17 GMT -6
I Accept!
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Post by Brewers GM(Mike) on Jan 10, 2012 11:44:24 GMT -6
Something smells fishy!!!
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Post by Cardinals GM(Jared) on Jan 10, 2012 11:54:11 GMT -6
i used to be impressed with rays.
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Post by New York Yankees GM(Tommy) on Jan 10, 2012 16:08:23 GMT -6
I'd say this is an exchange now of close to or more than 20 players between these two fishy isn't even the word
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Post by Brewers GM(Mike) on Jan 10, 2012 16:12:42 GMT -6
Ah the problem of brothers in the same league arises before the season even starts lol
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Post by darealastros on Jan 10, 2012 16:34:54 GMT -6
Cubs Send: Matt LaPorta 2rd #19 2rd# 25 3rd# 41 Rfa Marmol John Gaub RFA Rights to Brain McCann Josh Collmenter 7M 2014* Grady Sizemore $17M 2013* Seth Smith $5M 2014* A-RAM's RFA Adam JONES RFA Pat Neshek $1.5M 2013* Prospect Marc Kraus Reid Brignac *Rookie contract* $1.75 Prospect Phillippe Aumont
Rays Send:
Will Inman (Prospect) Denard Span 7M 2013 2nd Round #19 Mike Morse Trevor Cahill Brian Wilson Chris Marrero $4M Cap Hunter Pence $24M 2012+* Andrew Bailey $6.80M 2012*
Yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuup..........
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Post by Atlanta Braves GM(T.J.) on Jan 11, 2012 9:31:31 GMT -6
Alright gentlemen I have talked to Cubs EXTENSIVELY about this trade and I understand where they are both at. Cubs is competing and Rays is rebuilding. So what that they make a lot of trades together. Look at the track record. Kevin and I made like 12 deals in the 2010 season. Indians and I have done like 5 already. You all are reading to much into the brother aspect.
Here is my breakdown:
Pence - For an overpriced Sizemore, A-Jones RFA rights(who is statistically inferior to Pence), Brignac(who cares), and Kraus(who cares)
Bailey - Smith(Cubs could regret giving him up), Aumont(bp), Neshek(bp), A-Ram's rights(a good 3B option).
To me he overpaid by Smith. So what. There have been worse deals that have gone through.
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Post by New York Yankees GM(Tommy) on Jan 11, 2012 11:17:03 GMT -6
My take on this trade is simple. I like Cubs and don't want to accuse anyone of underhanded things but with that said let me explain why I feel the need for an official veto.
Whenever we make a deal in this league and someone veto's we fight and argue how fair it is and how lopsided it is. Then someone always seems to say "I'd only veto if there is obvious collusion".
Well we have come to the exact opposite here. This trade on paper actually isn't unfair. Did Cubs pay too much , sure maybe, did Rays get a ton of throw aways for free , debatable but yeah maybe but not enough to veto ..... BUT this is not a question of a fair trade as much as fair trade tactics.
Collusion is simply this. Does anyone not his brother get this offer? No. Does anyone get guys like Brignac, ARam and Jones who he valued extremely high just months ago basically for free? No. Would Cubs have given almost his entire draft class to any team in this league for the price? No. And would Rays in his first year in the auction take on 3 RFA rights essentially taking him out of the bidding for all others, then admit he may not sign some of them? No.
Unfair practices are happening whether by accident where it's just easy for them to work a deal because they have access to each other or not, that is the definition of collusion. Again I am not pointing fingers but that is the reason for the uproar. This is unfair trading practices.
In his own trade block posted this offseason ---
Brignac -- An Upgrade at SS would be nice too while I am waiting for Brignac for another year I'll include him too if you like him but I doubt it tho...
CF Grady Sizemore 17M 2013* I'll trade for a Return CF or SP.... (didn't get this)
RFA Rights to ARAM I would want a good pick for him...(did not get what he asked)
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Post by Brewers GM(Mike) on Jan 11, 2012 11:44:02 GMT -6
I do not have a vote. So Thank You Yanks!
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Post by Cardinals GM(Jared) on Jan 11, 2012 11:54:15 GMT -6
Rays Send: Hunter Pence $24M 2012+* (Fantasy stud) Andrew Bailey $6.80M 2012* (Fantasy stud) Cubs Send: Grady Sizemore $17M 2013* (Overpaid, below average, not someone you take on when "rebuilding") Seth Smith $5M 2014* (Good, but not a everyday guy in COL bc of their situation) A-RAM's RFA (ok, you got the rights to him but you have a 3b already, 2 actually although edwin and renoldys are 1bs) Adam JONES RFA (Y do you want grady and jones? Jones will be $$$) Pat Neshek $1.5M 2013* (Dude got cut last year) Prospect Marc Kraus (not a big time prospect, probably wont be a regular) Reid Brignac *Rookie contract* $1.75 (reid looked terrible last year) Prospect Phillippe Aumont (jonathan paplebob who?) I accept! VETO
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Post by New York Yankees GM(Tommy) on Jan 11, 2012 12:01:10 GMT -6
ummmm .... point proven ?
I was asking for more for AGON but hey I was a lil eazier on him but I think it is just BECAUSE he is My Brother
this is what I mean , this is the definition of collusion , maybe unintentional but yes this is collusion
also to say Jones's stats were a throw in because he doesn't have close to Pence's stats is just not fact. He had more homers, more steals, 14 less rbi and 16 less runs , and not like he's hurting in avg with a 280
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Post by New York Yankees GM(Tommy) on Jan 11, 2012 12:11:47 GMT -6
If you believe that Pence is Braun, Kemp, and them then it makes no sense to trade him for guys you may not even sign
You're telling me you'd trade Braun or Kemp for Steve Smith and Grady Sizemore then , because that's all the guarantee you got back
But again I am not arguing the trade I am arguing collusion which your brother admitted to
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2012 12:15:30 GMT -6
ummmm .... point proven ? I was asking for more for AGON but hey I was a lil eazier on him but I think it is just BECAUSE he is My Brother this is what I mean , this is the definition of collusion , maybe unintentional but yes this is collusion also to say Jones's stats were a throw in because he doesn't have close to Pence's stats is just not fact. He had more homers, more steals, 14 less rbi and 16 less runs , and not like he's hurting in avg with a 280 LOL Kevin isn't my brother u ...!!!! i still was Eazy on him is that a COLLUSION?? Jones OPS was UNDER .800 UNDER AVERAGE!!! While pence had 11 HR in the Lil stint he had with Pihllies and before he was in a Trash team like the SASTORS who didn't have anyone to back him up! onlly El Cabalo pndw ei!!!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2012 12:19:44 GMT -6
THIS is what is WRITTEN or TYPED!!! BTW Why is my Trading Block like that??? Well I really know how Shitty Offers i get day in day out for my players so that is why I asking like that but I can always settle for a deal like AGON Deal!!! I was asking for more for AGON but hey I was a lil eazier on him, (AGON went to STRO's IDIOT!!!) but I think it is just BECAUSE he is My Brother U want it to be a COLLUSION!!! It is OBVIOUS that i am going to COMPETE and He is REBUILDING!!! How are u Linking AGON with My Brother??? Are U STUPID or WHAT??? ummmm .... point proven ? I was asking for more for AGON but hey I was a lil eazier on him but I think it is just BECAUSE he is My Brother this is what I mean , this is the definition of collusion , maybe unintentional but yes this is collusion also to say Jones's stats were a throw in because he doesn't have close to Pence's stats is just not fact. He had more homers, more steals, 14 less rbi and 16 less runs , and not like he's hurting in avg with a 280
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